Showing posts with label IPSC Multigun. Show all posts
Showing posts with label IPSC Multigun. Show all posts

Saturday, January 26, 2013

USPSA and New Gun Restrictions

In my January 19, 2013 post "Stop the Rage .... Mine" (and several earlier posts!) , I summarized my... disappointed .. in the recurring political movement to restrict private firearms ownership.

Actually, what I did was to say I was through talking about it.

[sigh]

Wrong.  I'm not through talking about it.

One of the comments was ... perhaps offered facetiously, but still the question offered was entirely germane to this blog: 

Instead of delving into the progressive mindset, we should be asking the important questions. How will restrictions on certain firearms, and magazine capacity affect USPSA/IPSC rules and stage development? The feds are talking 10 round magazines, but NY has already mandated 7 round capacity mags and other states are sure to follow. How will USPSA respond to these potential draconian restrictions and/or bans in magazine capacity and firearms? What affect will they have on 3gun?
Oh, yeah,  we've been there before.

Some folks suggest that since the 1994 Assault Weapons Ban didn't really have much effect on .. gun stuff ... maybe this one will be equally as ineffective (if still equally inconvenient).

Well .. maybe so, maybe not.

I know that I found ways during that time period to get around the 'banned' items.  For example, I found a way to move from Limited to OPEN Division, including the purchasing of "normal capacity" magazines of 18 rounds (limited) and 25 rounds (open).  The magazines were all marked something like "only military or Law Enforcement" .. but I still got them.  The magazines cost three times as much as their replacement tubes did after the 1994 law sunset in 2004, of course.   Which is, of course, economically selective; "poor people" couldn't afford them, just us "rich folks".  (Or those of us who really like Tuna Fish and Macaroni for dinner six nights a week.)

But that was then; this is now.

For the purpose of this discussion, I'll ignore the very STRONG possibility that Race Guns (they have "compensators", you know) may be outlawed.  Also, "Firearms which may accept magazines of greater than 'x-rounds' capacity" will not be totally banned ... I'm not sure if that can even pass a Democratic congress; any magazine-fed firearm doesn't have a way to restrict the LENGTH of the magazine.

So, delving into excruciating detail, here's what I see as possible ways that Congress and Our Beloved Leader may screw us most painfully:

10-round Magazines:
Let us suppose, for the sake of argument, that ten-round magazines are the legally maximum capacity allowed under federal law.

Hmm .. the difference between LIMITED and LIMITED-10 Divisions have been been eliminated.

The Open Division can't use 25-round magazines; but they still have compensators and electronic dot-sights, so there is a clear advantage .. albeit LESS of an advantage .. over Limited/Limited-10 Divisions.  (Speaking as a 'vision-challenged' Super Senior: it's still an advantage when you can see the sights.)

I might point out, however, that current USPSA rules limit the number of shots which MUST be fired from a single location, port or position.  Any time you move, you have a small window of opportunity when you may reload.  Speaking for myself, I moved from "C-class" to "B-class" using a single-stack 1911 in 1998 when Limited-10 Division was still a "Talking Point" in USPSA.  If you gotta move, you gotta reload.  BFD.

Production and L-10 Divisions were predicated on limited magazine capacity.  Even Limited has a 144-mm magazine length restriction, which means you can probably stuff 18-20 9mm rounds in there, so ... who cares?

Single-Stack has limited capacity, under 10 rounds.
.
Revolver .. huh.  Who cares; they're only shooting 6-shot loads anyway.  And Jerry Miculek is possibly the only man in the world who doesn't care if he can get a 20-round Revolver or not.


 So, how about the possibility of a 7-round magazine capacity restriction?

Okay, so now we're talking about being really shitty for no discernible reason.

In the first place, the USPSA rule about limiting the number of rounds which must be fired from a single location/position/etc. have been completely undermined.  A 10-round magazine can handle a 9-round maximum; a 7-round magazine can not.

Since most stages include IPSC targets (cardboard, requiring 2 rounds to 'neutralize'), you could only have three targets in most array .. rather than the four (presuming a 9-round max per location) currently presented.  So ... many, even most, of the Classifiers would be either revamped or discarded.

That pretty much hoses the entire Classifier System which USPSA currently uses to decide who is Top Dog in any given Division/Class.


 On the other hand, when I started competing in USPSA/IPSC, the standard assumed that a Revolver was the 'standard/minimal firearm', so all stages were designed to be "six-round friendly".  So .. target arrays included 3 IPSC targets instead of 4, and .. have you noticed that plate-racks still have six plates?  Baby, we haven't got THAT far away from our technological roots.

We're just going back from 10-round-friendly target arrays to 6-round friendly target arrays.

The difference is, if the Federales have their way, we're just going back a decade (or two) to minimum rounds per shooting position, from 9 to 6.  (Citation needed here).

In other words, the current 9-round maximum rule presupposes a 10-round magazine capacity.  A 6-round maximum rule presupposes a 7-round magazine capacity.

It sucks to be a Limited or an Open Division Competitor, in that case.

Look for Open Division to remain strong (but magazines will be a lot cheaper).  The difference between Limited and L-10 will disappear.  Assume that L-10 will not be very popular .. there's no advantage to being able to reload quickly.   In fact, L-10 (or Limited .. whichever survives) and Singlestack will be much more competitive.

Production?  The discrimination between Production and Singlestack will also blur.  Who knows which will predominate.  Note that 1911-style handguns are specifically forbidden in Production, and the Single-Stack Division will disallow the double-stack magazines which are typical in Production Division.

My guess is that Production and Single-Stack will merge in Limited Division ... which was once "STOCK DIVISION" .. and which may be the best choice for the entire definition of "no compensators, no electronic sights".   The only discernible difference between Production and Single-Stack/Limited is that Production now specifically excludes 1911 frames (Prod vs SS) and Single-Stack precludes double-stack magazines (which Limited does not).

TO beat this dead horse a little further:  Limited will accept both Single-Stack and Production firearms, but the placement of holsters and magazine carriers is less restrictive.  Would we really need to cause the differences between the three divisions so picky as to center on holster placement?  (Well, okay .. Limited allows more modifications than does Production .....)

SUMMARY:


REVOLVER DIVISION: no changes
OPEN DIVISION:  Okay, no Big-Sticks, but still a viable Division.  Think of it as "Limited:, But Still Cooler!  And better for weak-eyed old guys.
LIMITED DIVISION: probably no change
LIMITED-10 DIVISION: probably not viable; no real difference between L10 and Limited
PRODUCTION DIVISION:  Probably the same as Limited except for equipment placement and maximum number of rounds allowed ... which wouldn't matter, legally.  That, and 1911's are specifically disallowed.
SINGLE-STACK DIVISION: Probably the same as Production, except that 1911s are specifically allowed and double-stack magazines still are NOT .. not that it matters.

IF I WERE USPSA PRESIDENT, HERE'S WHAT I WOULD CHANGE:
  • I would combine Production and Single-Stack, except that maybe the modifications .. I don't know, it's still debatable
  • Open and Limited differences remain based on electronic sights and compensators
  • Revolvers .. who cares?  God knows THEY don't care!
  • Limited and Limited-10 ... Limited-10 is definitively deleted.

________________________________________________________________________

This entire exposition is extemporaneous and not well organized.  It's an off-the-cuff attempt to respond to what turns out to be a very good question .. assuming that Obama's Gun-Killer Legislation ever becomes law.  (That is NOT beyond the realm of possibility in the current Politicized climate.)

You can be sure that these issues are being discussed around the water-cooler at Sedro Woolley, and I think it would be a service to all USPSA members if their thoughts could be shared with the rest of us .. RSN.

Jerry The Geek




Thursday, June 16, 2011

Area 1 Director wins "Super Trooper" at FNH USA 3-gun National Shoot-Off.

Shooting Wire: "Anderson Wins 3GN Shoot-Off, $5K From Warne":
"PARMA, Idaho - A year ago, Chuck Anderson came up one run short. This time around, he could not be denied.

Anderson, delivering remarkable speed on the pistol, upset perennial favorite Daniel Horner in the finals of the FNH USA 3-Gun Nation Shoot-Off, Presented by SureFire, following the MGM Ironman to win $5,000 from Warne Scope Mounts on June 11.

Anderson qualified for the 3GN Shoot-Off by defending his Trooper class title at Ironman, one of the most unique divisions held anywhere. In Trooper division, competitors are required to carry all their gear on their person for the duration of the match. With shooters carrying as many as six firearms, ammunition and gear, especially at the physical slugfest that is MGM's Ironman, winning Trooper division is a major achievement." (emphasis added by Geek)


Congratulations, Chuck!

I've watched Mr. Anderson compete in USPSA matches for years, and he has always been among the top shooters. A working LEO, Chuck has always been a hard man to beat. Although I'm not familiar with the "Trooper division", it sounds like a true Iron Man category.

I'm impressed, you should be too.

I'll be working the Chrono stage at the Area 1 match later this month. Hope to see him there, so I can offer him my personal congratulations.

Thursday, July 10, 2008

2008 R&R Racing Multigun Match at ARPC

Saturday and Sunday (July 12-13, 2oo8) Bobby Wright will be hosting the "R&R Racing" multigun match at Albany Rifle & Pistol Club.

The match is limited to 85 competitors, and will involve using 'any' combination of 3 guns (pistol, rifle, shotgun) on each of the ten stages.

Here's the line-up of stages:

Stage 1: "Knock Knock" (Rifle & Shotgun)
Stage 2: "Watch Your Breathing" (Shotgun & Rifle)
Stage 3: "Long Range" (Pistol & Rifle)
Stage 4: "Corridor" (Pistol & Shotgun)
Stage 5: "Ports" (Pistol & Shotgun)
Stage 6: "The Fair" (Shotgun & Pistol)
Stage 7: "Big Shot" (Rifle & Pistol)
Stage 8: "Cubicles" (Pistol & Rifle)
Stage 9: "Survivor II" (Pistol & Shotgun)
Stage 10: "Junction City" (Shotgun & Rifle)

The following documents are currently available at the R&R Racing Website:
Sign Up sheet. (Word Document)

Stages. (Excel spreadsheet)

Rules. (Word Document)

Sponsors (unknown Word Document)

The Match Fee (after May 24) is $275, it may betoo late to get a room in the Match Hotel, but contact Bobby (see the website for contact information), but if you show up at the match at 8am on Saturday, 12 July, 2008, you may still may be able to make some accommodation.

As usual, I'm posting this notice later than I should, but I'm assuming that interested competitors have already signed up for the match.

I'm not really trying to tempt more competitors here, although if the match is not yet fully subscribed that would be nice. Instead, I'm identifying a pending match.

I'll be there, taking pictures and interviewing participants.

Although this is not a USPSA match, , because the strict USPSA rules are not being followed (see the above rules description) and Wright is therefore not paying Match Fees to USPSA), I will be submitting an article to the USPSA Front Sight Magazine, which will probably be published in the November/December issue..

Are there rules of competition which are not best represented by the USPSA Multi-Gun rules?

I don't know.

Come, watch the match with me as we compare the two sets of rules to determine which are most reasonable.

I'll have pictuers.

Tuesday, April 29, 2008

FIrst Ever Afghanistan 3 gun match

From the Texican Tattler blogspot comes the Texican Tattler: 3 gun video.

This movie shows the construction of multiple COF (Courses of Fire) to create an actual match in the barren sands of Afghanistan.

(I'm taking a lot of this on faith, and assuming even more ... such as, while this is obviously serving U.S. Military I assume they're Army personnel.)

As a CRO I see a lot of potential problems with the stage designs, such as shoot-throughs on a no-shoot/shoot target array, but that's just my petty anal retentive self.

As an American, I'm as proud as I can be to see IPSC/USPSA competition techniques, stages and materials being used by our serving military.

The production of the video is excellent; good photography, excellent editing. I rate this video an enthusiastic Four Geeks Up! ****

(The original is available at YouTube.)

Note: you may recall the Texican Tattler as the original source for the "84 Snakes in a Tub" video (Snakes in a Drain) which I posted in March of 2008. This tears it ... they're going on my sidebar.

Wednesday, June 20, 2007

Albany Oregon Multi-Gun Matches

If you're a "Multi-Gun" competitor, Oregon is the place to be in July.

The Albany Rifle & Pistol Club (ARPC) is hosting two (2) Multi-Gun matches in July of 2007.

On July 1 (Sunday), ARPC will wrap up its June 29 - July 1 (Friday throught Sunday) Area 1 Multigun Championship.


And on July 13-14 (Saturday and Sunday), Robert Wright of R&R Racing will present the Northwest Multi-Gun Championships (NWMGC).
(Range Officers will shoot the NWMGC match on Friday, July 13.)


If you're unfamiliar with the Multigun concept, you may recall that in 2006 I wrote about the 2006 USPSA Multigun Championships, which also was hosted by ARPC. (Also see here.)

Links for the Area 1 "3-gun match" (okay, there's a difference between 3-gun and multigun; see below) are available here. USPSA links here.

Note that the terminology "3-gun" is embedded in the host North American Shooting Sports Online (NASSONLINE) webpage. The link for the "3-gun" match include the stage procedures. Stage 1: "Broke Down in Borax" specifiy that both a pistol and rifle are to be used in the same stage, which clearly makes this a "Multi-Gun" match. I'm sure that NASSONLINE will correct this inadvertant error in the near future.

The July 14-15 Northwest Multi-Gun Challenge information may be found on the R&R Racing website. (Detail information here, PDF entry form here.)

The June 13 deadline for the NWMGC match has been extended past June 13. No shirts are available for late entries, but (as of June 23) you can still sign up for this match.


3-gun vs Multi-gun
According to the USPSA Rules (2005 is the latest edition I can find):

A “multi-gun match” is defined as a match (see 6.1.4) in which at least one stage involves the use of two or more different firearm types. A multi-gun match may involve any combination of handgun, rifle and shotgun usage, including stages which involve one, two or all three firearm types. Other than the use of multiple firearm types, all other provisions of 6.1.4 apply.

Conversely, a "3-gun" match is one in which all three guns (handgun, rifle, shotgun) are used but each stage uses only one gun.

I've never competed in either a 3-gun or a multi-gun match, but I have observed a multi-gun match and one of the complexities which lends so much to the excitement is the moment when a competitor switches from one gun to the next. And in a stage which utilizes all three guns, it can get a little hairy.

Note that I'm not talking about safety factors. The competitor is typically required to clear the gun he is leaving, and deposit said cleared (read: EMPTY, NO AMMUNITION) in a provided receptical before he can pick up the next gun. At no time may the competitor move downrange of a loaded firearm. *

Of course, that isn't an issue in a "3-gun" match.
I plan to attend both matches as an observer. I'll be there with eyes and ears, at least two cameras and a tripod. Hopefully, I'll get some interesting footage to post here.
(This post originated on 6/20/2007)

* UPDATE - June 25, 2007

See the comment from Trey. Disposition of one firearm before continuing a stage with another firearm MAY not require clearing the previous gun.